Forum: The Racing Rules of Sailing

When should X be displayed?

Anders Rydlöv
Nationality: Sweden
Certifications:
  • National Judge
  • National Umpire
Hi! 

Maybe for raceofficers but might be important to all: When is it proper to display X individual recall?

Two boats duelled without crossing the starting line ending windward of the extension. 15s before starting signal they returned, still above the extension of the starting line aiming well outside pin end. RC signalled X.  This led to confusion among sailors and since the regatta was a team race some boats returned - without being early - these boats later requested redress suggesting improper action by RC.  The request was not valid. 

What is the difference to match race,  some of the starting rules and RRS22.1 where the extensions is explicit written in the rule? . How do you interprete this in a way not creating confusion among sailors? 

Anders 
Created: 22-Sep-27 17:07

Comments

P
Nicole Butterworth
Nationality: Bermuda
Certifications:
  • Umpire In Training
  • Club Judge
  • National Race Officer
0
A start line is a start line as defined by the race documents including extension - but normally just defined as a start line. In normal fleet racing the boat is X-Flag if you are over the start line at the start (0 seconds). If you are above the start line at the start and haven't crossed it, even sailing above, the boat is DNS not OCS and therefore can't be 'recalled individually' so no X-Flag can be used. The boats that started normally for that match should have continued racing regardless. This also the normal situation in Team Racing. Assuming this is a P flag type start so none of RRS 30 comes into play at all. Personally, I would have left the race running (no recall, as it doesn't apply) and told the scorer/scribe/finish boat about the 2 boats being DNS  (if they never come back and start within start time limit (if stated) ) - it wasn't RO error, it's the boats' error for not crossing the start line as defined by the race documents. Also depends on the age and experience - if it was more of a learning environment, I may do something different.

You've stated this is team racing and then brought up Match Racing - two different Appendices (D & C respectively). In Match Racing if OCS at start or failing to enter start box on time is a penalty to that boat (or both, then they cancel out) - Code Flags for recall are not used in Match Racing generally.
Created: 22-Sep-27 17:45
P
Angelo Guarino
Nationality: United States
Certifications:
  • Regional Judge
  • Fleet Measurer
0
Nicole re: “If you are above the start line at the start and haven't crossed it, even sailing above, the boat is DNS not OCS and therefore can't be 'recalled individually' so no X-Flag can be used. ”

I don't think that’s precisely correct.  OCS includes “did not start”. 

From Appx A10

OCS Did not start; on the course side of the starting line at her starting signal and failed to start, or broke rule 30.1 

We have an old thread someplace where we dove into this question.  Lemme see if I can dig it up (or anyone else who finds it please post). 

The “shall” RC instruction for the X-flag is described in rule 29.1.  It does not include any statement regarding the boat crossing the line. 

29.1 Individual Recall
When at a boat’s starting signal any part of her hull is on the course side of the starting line or she must comply with rule 30.1, the race committee shall promptly display flag X with one sound. The flag shall be displayed until the hull of each such boat has been completely on the pre-start side of the starting line or one of its extensions, and until all such boats have complied with rule 30.1 if it applies, but no later than four minutes after the starting signal or one minute before any later starting signal, whichever is earlier. If rule 29.2, 30.3 or 30.4 applies this rule does not.
Created: 22-Sep-27 17:55
Tim Hohmann
Nationality: United States
Certifications:
  • Regional Judge
0
Rule 29.1 uses "starting line" and "starting line or one of its extensions" separately and specifically, suggesting to me that there's a distinction. Use of "starting line or one of its extensions" in C3.2(a)(1) (changing 29.1 for match racing) reinforces this impression.

So in fleet racing (or team racing, which doesn't appear to change 29.1) I don't think a boat that's on the course side of an extension of the line at her starting signal has broken 29.1. Obviously such a boat would still have to get below the line to start properly and would still be keep clear under 21.1 while doing so. Sounds like displaying the X flag in this circumstance was an improper action by the RC.

Was the redress request deemed not valid because there was no improper action or omission, or for some other reason?
Created: 22-Sep-27 18:28
P
Peter van Muyden
Nationality: Canada
Certifications:
  • Judge In Training
  • International Race Officer
0
Assuming that RRS 30.1 didn't apply, the race committee made two errors regarding RRS 29.1 
  1. It signaled an individual recall before the starting signal (15 seconds)
  2. It signaled an individual recall when the boats were above the extension of the starting line.  RRS 29.1 refers to the course side of the starting line which doesn't include the extension.  The extension comes into play when RRS 30.1 applies. 
Created: 22-Sep-27 18:40
P
Angelo Guarino
Nationality: United States
Certifications:
  • Regional Judge
  • Fleet Measurer
0
Tim, but even as you describe, a boat could be on the course side of the starting line without crossing it in close proximity of their starting signal.  Crossing the line is not a requirement. 

I found the thread.  It was my old “puzzler word-problem for NYE”.   It’s a very long thread with lots of diagrams   and of course head-of-pin-dancing. 

https://www.racingrulesofsailing.org/posts/501-ocs-around-the-pin-end
Created: 22-Sep-27 18:45
P
Angelo Guarino
Nationality: United States
Certifications:
  • Regional Judge
  • Fleet Measurer
0
Here is probably the most focused pic on the question from my puzzler thread …

image.png 13 KB


Gun goes off at #2, no X-flag?
Created: 22-Sep-27 19:57
Anders Rydlöv
Nationality: Sweden
Certifications:
  • National Judge
  • National Umpire
0
Thanks for your answers!

Tim, not valid due to SI procedure.
Peter, RC signalled promptly after the start. 

Another comment: If the extension IS in play it will be much harder to observe boats returning at the starting vessel end. 
In this specific case PRO said it was hard to determine from the starting vessel end  if the boats were positioned outside or inside at the pin end. Much more so if it´s a longer line with greater number of boats.  In this race it was eight boats. 

I will check the thread! 






Created: 22-Sep-28 07:52
Anders Rydlöv
Nationality: Sweden
Certifications:
  • National Judge
  • National Umpire
0
Ahh yes a lot of beautiful "boxes" in the thread. Thanks! Hard to apply without being defined I would say. Laylines after upwind start must be included anyway as well as all angels in other starts. 
I believe that RC has a grade of freedom here... and that it´s hard to get redress ("no fault of her own" and "omission by RC"). We have to wait for the jury to decide...
Created: 22-Sep-28 19:48
Tim Hohmann
Nationality: United States
Certifications:
  • Regional Judge
0
Gun goes off at #2, no X-flag?

If I'm a judge in a hearing, I could probably be convinced that the conditions of 29.1 were not met so failure to display an X flag is not an omission.

If I'm the PRO, X flag almost certainly would go up, I would think.

In either case the boat has not started properly and has no excuse for not knowing it, so score OCS.


Created: 22-Sep-28 20:04
Tim Hohmann
Nationality: United States
Certifications:
  • Regional Judge
0
This is the harder one from the old thread, I think. If the starting signal is at 2 (and assuming the bow is on but not over the starting line) has she complied with the definition of start?

I suspect this is another one where the boat is technically wrong but no race officer would ever spot it or call it.






Created: 22-Sep-28 20:10
Anders Rydlöv
Nationality: Sweden
Certifications:
  • National Judge
  • National Umpire
0
Hi Tim
I disagree on orange boat not starting correct.
Created: 22-Sep-29 11:10
P
Angelo Guarino
Nationality: United States
Certifications:
  • Regional Judge
  • Fleet Measurer
0
Tim, the reaching start is a good one too …

image.png 55.3 KB
Created: 22-Sep-29 11:24
P
Angelo Guarino
Nationality: United States
Certifications:
  • Regional Judge
  • Fleet Measurer
0
Anders, it’s based on the perpendicular projected area concept of the pre-start and course-side of the line not including the extensions. 

The green line is the boundary on the prestart side between the starting-line and it’s extension. 

image.jpeg 15.3 KB
Created: 22-Sep-29 13:56
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