Forum: Protest Hearing Procedures

Speed/Time/Distance - Lasers

Bob Meagher
Nationality: United States of America
Certifications:
  • National Judge
Does anyone have a speed/time/distance table (or spreadsheet) for Lasers?
Created: 21-Dec-17 13:16

Comments

Carl Schellbach
Nationality: United States of America
Certifications:
  • National Race Officer
1
Morning Bob-
Peter Van Muyden has a bunch of those on his website. Interactive and all that.  http://jpvm.org Or shoot me an email and I'll send what I have to you.

Best,
-- Carl
Created: 21-Dec-17 13:40
Roberto Armellin
Nationality: Italy
Certifications:
  • International Judge
  • Regional Umpire
  • National Race Officer
0
pls get a look to this link:
"https://view.officeapps.live.com/op/view.aspx?src=http%3A%2F%2Ffinckh.net%2Fdeutsch%2Fmaterial%2Fformulare%2Ftargettimes.xls&wdOrigin=BROWSELINK"
cheers,
Rob
Created: 21-Dec-17 13:52
Mark DeGuire
Nationality: United States of America
Certifications:
  • Club Judge
  • Club Race Officer
0
See tabs for different classes:
https://assets.rya.org.uk/assetbank-rya-assets/action/directLinkImage?assetId=50444
Created: 21-Dec-17 14:07
P
Peter van Muyden
Nationality: Canada
Certifications:
  • Judge In Training
  • International Race Officer
1
Here is a link to my target time models:  https://www.dropbox.com/sh/dpum6zdg3j81cx8/AAC0LQWejFjG3VpY2kqXImEka?dl=0   The Laser models are pretty accurate, but you can adjust them if needed.  The models will give you a windward leg length based on wind speed and a forecasted race time based on the rounding time of any of the marks.   Email me if you need further explanation.

Peter  
Created: 21-Dec-17 14:42
P
Paul Jackson
Nationality: United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland
Certifications:
  • International Race Officer
0
These will help 
https://www.rya.org.uk/racing/running-racing/speed-charts
These are what we use.

Created: 21-Dec-17 15:54
Al Sargent
Nationality: United States of America
0
Bob, when you wrote your request, I interpreted it as something like, "how many seconds for a Laser to sail X boatlengths, at various points of sail and wind speeds". To corroborate testimony during protest hearings, e.g., "We entered the 3 boatlength zone, and 10 seconds later I began rounding the mark."

Do the race management links above work for you, or were you looking for something more along the lines of what I'm suggesting? 
Created: 21-Dec-17 20:19
Bob Meagher
Nationality: United States of America
Certifications:
  • National Judge
0
You are correct, I'm looking for the judging resource, not the race management tool, but they are fascinating.
Created: 21-Dec-17 20:45
Carl Schellbach
Nationality: United States of America
Certifications:
  • National Race Officer
0
Bob-
I just sent you a PM with a speed and distance table for fulls and radials. Each knot is 1.688888 ft/sec, and the speeds are taken from the Speeds worksheet in the files that Roberto, Mark and Peter linked (they're all close enough to each other for government work).
Created: 21-Dec-17 21:53
Al Sargent
Nationality: United States of America
0
Carl, it'd be great to see those speed and distance tables if you're comfortable sharing.

Bob, one data point is that in ~10 knots, a Laser will sail from ~8 kph to ~16 kph downwind, depending on whether it's surfing or not. 
(We know this from a video by Brett Bayer, a 14x Laser Masters World Champ, who shared a training video with us. It's behind a subscription paywall, so I cannot share it here.)

Given that there are 1.852 kilometers in a nautical mile, each kph is 0.9 foot/second.

So, a Laser non-surfing in ~10 knots will do ~7 feet/second (= 8 kph * 0.9 foot/second/kph, or half a boatlength per second). A Laser surfing in ~10 knots will do twice that: ~14 feet/second -- that's one boatlength per second, which means a 3 BL zone will be traversed in 3 seconds.

Bigger picture, if there are time/distance questions in a protest involving Lasers, it's worth asking about wave state and if/when someone was surfing (or upwind, pounding), since either of those will impact boatspeed and the time/distance situation.  
Created: 21-Dec-17 22:58
Mark Townsend
Nationality: United States of America
Certifications:
  • International Race Officer
  • International Umpire
  • International Judge
2
Attached is a protest hearing procedure card that I use. On one side is a hearing checklist, on the other is a chart I use to figure out how long a boat takes to travel one boat length at a given speed and a decision tree to help you understand if a boat broke rule 14. Hope they help.   

Protest Hearing Procedures 2021-2024.pdf 383 KB


image.png 198 KB


image.png 312 KB


Created: 21-Dec-18 00:24
Ewan McEwan
Nationality: United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland
Certifications:
  • Regional Race Officer
  • International Judge
  • International Umpire
0
What I particularly like about Peter Van Muyden‘s charts is the predicted finish time look up table that he includes - handy to keep everything on track.
Created: 21-Dec-18 01:26
Philip Hubbell
Nationality: United States of America
Certifications:
  • Club Race Officer
  • Judge In Training
-1
I appreciate the value of speed/time/distance tables for RC setting up drop buoy courses, 
but doubt their usefulness in the protest room regarding boat-for-boat interactions, 
other than their psyche-out/bullying bluffery.
Created: 21-Dec-18 21:32
Ewan McEwan
Nationality: United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland
Certifications:
  • Regional Race Officer
  • International Judge
  • International Umpire
0
There are useful for identifying probabilities. Which is one of the more important abilities for judging a situation.
Created: 21-Dec-18 23:08
Leo Reise
Nationality: Canada
Certifications:
  • International Judge
0
I have a time / speed / distance chart if anyone wants it.
Email me.  Email can be found In World Sailing, US Sailing or Sail Canada Officials.

Created: 21-Dec-19 00:29
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