Forum: The Racing Rules of Sailing

Outside assistance by the RC?

Paul Zupan
Nationality: United States of America
Certifications:
  • National Judge
  • International Judge
  • Regional Umpire
During the last minute of the starting sequence, the RC hails that “some boats are getting very close to the line." These boats dip a little and the fleet starts with no boats OCS. Do you think the RC unfairly assisted boats who would have otherwise been OCS?
Created: 18-Sep-22 04:28

Comments

John Culter
Nationality: Canada
Certifications:
  • National Race Officer
0
See RRS 41 (c) and (d). We often add additional language in the SIs specifically allowing the RC to hail boats in the last two minutes. But for most cases the rule as it stands is sufficient. Para (c) would apply if hailing were done by VHF; otherwise we would rely on (d).

This happens most often with Laser Radials, and maybe Optis. Not a good idea for major championships, but useful for local and regional events.
Created: 18-Sep-22 05:22
Eric Rimkus
Nationality: United States of America
Certifications:
  • National Judge
  • Regional Race Officer
0
No, assuming all competitors had an equal opportunity to hear the hail. But not a good practice for the RC in my opinion unless it’s a club or casual event.
Created: 18-Sep-22 05:53
Nick Hutton
Nationality: Australia
Certifications:
  • International Race Officer
0
No self-respecting dinghy RO would give information to competitors as to their position in relation to the line. The main reason is that the race committee cannot communicate the info to all competitors so should not communicate to any.

Occasionally SIs will create an ability to provide assistance by raising or lowering code flag Victor as boats break the line, but this is a very imprecise measure (which boat?, how many boats?, etc) and in my view should be discouraged.

Created: 18-Sep-22 06:16
Matt Bounds
Nationality: United States of America
Certifications:
  • National Judge
  • National Race Officer
0
I think Paul's setting you up to read US Sailing Appeal 118

From the appeal - "No rule in The Racing Rules of Sailing forbids the race committee from hailing boats before the language regarding the race committee hailing boats before the starting signal. In some situations this action will be considered acceptable and appropriate, and in some situations it will be considered not acceptable or appropriate; i.e., “improper.” One reason given for hailing is that the race committee’s job is to get the race started, and having general recalls, and especially multiple general recalls, is frustrating for all the sailors. For these reasons, the answer to Question 1 depends on the level of the event, the norm for races run by that race committee, the consistency with which it is applied, what the sailors want or expect, and what is stated in the sailing instructions or other rules governing the event."
Created: 18-Sep-22 12:01
Angelo Guarino
Nationality: United States of America
Certifications:
  • Judge In Training
  • Fleet Measurer
1
"Yuck" ... I would be pissed too if I was skipper who requested redress.

I guess if this was consistent across all races .. within or at a certain time before the gun ... always done in the same way and to the same standard .. then ... well .. maybe ok then.

Matt .. your link seemed to be broken. Here is an attempt to post the Appeal. US Appeal 118
Created: 18-Sep-22 13:13
Paul Zupan
Nationality: United States of America
Certifications:
  • National Judge
  • International Judge
  • Regional Umpire
0
It is indeed about US Appeal 118, but I'm wondering how people feel about it outside the US.
Created: 18-Sep-22 13:21
Nigel Vick
Nationality: United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland
Certifications:
  • International Judge
  • National Umpire
0
As a sailor when starting near the committee boat, I will quite often listen to the time being called on a committee boat rather than rely on my own watch. Am I cheating? As this information clearly is not available to all competitors.

Similarly as a race officer I will very often use a relatively loud voice when recording boats near to the line, I wouldn't say I hail them, but if they happen to hear, it helps the race get away.

I think the appeal says it all - it depends on the circumstances.
Created: 18-Sep-23 09:54
Juan Carlos Soneyra
Nationality: Argentina
Certifications:
  • National Judge
  • National Umpire
  • National Race Officer
1
When starting Opti Juniors in a very strong current in local championships I use a loadspeaker on the last minute of the starting procedure to alert kids they are very close to the line and in danger of resulted OCS.
I don't mention the sail number and the power of the electronic equipment is good enough to cover the entire extention of the line.
It proved to be educational, helped a lot to those who recognised to be the ones alerted, and avoided general recalls.
Instructors and parents congratulated me for that action.
No one feld offended.
Created: 18-Sep-23 15:02
Angelo Guarino
Nationality: United States of America
Certifications:
  • Judge In Training
  • Fleet Measurer
0
Nick & Juan, I agree with both your posts. In both you are talking about doing something consistently and also in Juan's example, something applying to Juniors in Optis. If you read the appeal, I think they are describing something different. First, it's collegiate (Harvard) and they describe the following ... (emphasis added)

During the last minute of the starting sequence for one of the races, the RC line caller notices that several boats ..... The line caller makes a clearly audible statement towards the fleet that “some boats are getting very close to the line” or words to that affect.

Having this being done just "for one of the races" is the slippery-slope I think .. or in other words, I guess I'm having the hardest time with Question #4 in the Appeal as the inconsistency gives a whiff of unfairness to me.

Created: 18-Sep-24 00:01
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