The Racing Rules of Sailing
Tacking in the zone after rounding a leeward mark
Several incidents and questions have come up regarding the obligations of a boat that tacks immediately after rounding a leeward mark to port. I think most of it is clear, and I think I have resolved the last question for myself. But I am interested in the opinions of others.
Scenario: Two boats on Port gybe approach a leeward mark to be rounded to port. Yellow enters the zone several boat lengths ahead of Blue and will be rounding and tacking to starboard while Blue is entering the zone heading to round such that they are on collision course at position 5.
Some easy parts: 18 does not apply (18.1a3). While tacking, rule 13 applies to Yellow and she must keep clear until born off to close hauled.
My question involves rule 15 and my uncertainty derives from USA Sailing appeal US52. That case found that a boat initially to leeward, gybing to starboard is right of way throughout and therefore rule 15 does not apply. However, there is no rule equivalent to rule 13 that applies while gybing. My interpretation is that a boat tacking from leeward to starboard is subject to rule 15 because she is the keep clear boat while rule 13 applies. Her position as starboard is a newly acquired right of way.
Through the course of the event I am considering, Yellow goes from clear ahead (Positions 1-3), to leeward (Position 4), to starboard (Position 5). But Yellow is the keep clear boat during the tack. So I conclude that she is subject to rule 15 as she completes the tack.
She must initially give Blue room to keep clear (whatever "initially" means in the extant conditions).
Any opposing views?
Created: Tue 17:43
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So RRS 15, “when a boat acquires right of way…” doesn’t apply.
RRS 13 uses “keep clear,” so I don’t see how yellow “looses” her status as RoW boat while taking because she instantly goes from leeward and luffing to starboard and bearing off. RRS 13 is just an obligation to do something (between HtW and CH), but it doesn’t transfer the RoW to the other boat.
Through this entire evolution the only rule that I see at play for Yellow is RRS 16.1 and, briefly, RRS 13.
A boat has right of way over another boat when the other boat is required to keep clear of her.
That is incorrect.
The preamble of Part 2 Section A states ..
RRS 13 states ..
Therefore 13 absolutely transfers ROW to ALL other boats that are not likewise simultaneously tacking. The "tacking" boat must keep clear of all of them .. therefore they all have ROW over her.
"Section ARIGHT OF WAY
I don't think 'right of way' or 'stand down' were ever used in the COLREGS/IRPCAS.
By all means show me a version where they were.
Whilst tacking yellow is keep clear boat hence Blue acquires right of way.
As soon as Yellow is close hauled on starboard, Yellow on port tack becomes keep clear boat. At this moment Yellow acquires right of way.
Now in my opinion rule 15 does come into play because here Yellow is acquiring right of way therefore it is obliged to initially give blue room to keep clear.
In my opinion, the move by Yellow is not very well thought out.
Second, Yellow is putting herself in position that she may get DSQ, if proper protest is filed.
When Yellow achieves her close-haul course, she re-gains her ROW and R 15 turns ON.
In your scenario, I will argue that Blue has absolutely no way out to avoid a collision with Yellow while manoeuvring promptly in a seamanlike way.
Yellow’s best action is to tack back to Port as soon as she is aware of Blue’s location. That may keep Yellow out protest room and avoid a collision.
Kim
We're judges not tactics coaches.
Maybe, but that's what RRS 15 is there for. Y is required to give B room to keep clear.
You're kidding me?
How is a hard luff not an ordinary seamanlike manoeuvre.
'Crash gybe', OK Case 99
But, leaving aside fragile rigs and very heavy conditions, I've never been able to work out the difference between a fast gybe when a boat wants to gybe quickly, and a 'crash gybe', particularly in a una rig like a Laser.
I also thought about it tactically, since I coach high-school kids. But, as John said, that wasn't the question for this forum. We agree across the board on the answer to the rules issue.
The question came up in out Sunfish fleet. Also, I was involved in one where I was driving a friend's Harbor 20 around the leeward mark during our Thursday Night Thing. A Melges 15 tacked after rounding right in front of me. The owner of the Harbor was more animated in his response than I was.
In my discussion with the M15 sailor afterward (he is an aspiring judge), I covered the rules issues we discussed here and added that it's often not a smart decision if boats are approaching.
I think I sit somewhere between you and John on what would constitute "unseamanlike" and it depends on the boats and conditions, of course. If Blue could avoid Yellow with a quick luff, turndown and back up around the mark, I think that would still fall under seamanlike (as drawn, I don't think that would be an option). But if Blue luffed up hard, had to gybe to get to the mark, then gybe again to round all that close to the mark, I don't think that Y gave him room to comply with rule 31 in a seamanlike manner. Adding all the boats you put in definitely makes it impossible for Blue to comply with part 2 rules in a seamanlike way.
As an aside, if you are using "SailReplay" there is an option to change the number of a boat in its start position. Your drawing is clear given the context of our discussion. But it confuses the times of each position
Look forward to working with you again soon.
Tony
B keeps clear and two gybes later she hits the mark.
That was a result of B rushing her gybes and misjudging her approach to the mark.
But as a tactical assessment I wouldn't expect B to even try to luff in front of Y.
As diagrammed, it's all on Y. I think the only option for Y is to change course to starboard and let B through.
I actually did this maneuver 2 Wed's ago in a fleet of 26 J/105's .. 14g18kts. It was a downwind start out-n-back course from Annapolis Harbor. I got stuck on the outside and behind at the leeward rounding and had to tack away asap .. I had a nice gap and tacked to starboard (forcing a competitor to likewise tack). That said, had there been boats closer coming under spin I would have waited as port-boats under spin might be sent to the wrong side of the mark and broadsides with others.
Highly situational and IMO deserves an extra bit of caution and calculation by Yellow.
I actually did this maneuver 2 Wed's ago on a fleet of 26 J/105's .. 15g20kts. It was a downwind start out-n-back course from Annapolis Harbor. I got stuck on the outside and behind at the leeward rounding and had to tack away asap .. I had a nice gap and tacked to starboard (forcing a competitor to likewise tack). That said, had there been boats closer coming under spin I would have waited as port-boats under spin might be sent to the wrong side of the mark and broadsides with others.
Highly situational and IMO deserves an extra bit of caution and calculation by Yellow.
PS: At the same time .. there was a T-bone at that mark between 2 105's .. both sustained sig-damage and are out for repairs.
We may just disagree on that. And it does depend on conditions and the boats.
B is not obliged to start avoiding until Y’s tack is complete (though it might be smart to react sooner and hail protest).
In support of your view, Y does not have to give B room to pass on the correct side of the mark, only room to avoid hitting it. If a hard luff avoided Y, but left B aiming at the wrong side of the mark, Y could argue convincingly that she gave B room.
In the original post, there are exactly two boats displayed. If we stick to that situation, Blue has heaps of room to avoid, as does Yellow after she tacks. But only for a specific class of boat with known maneuverability characteristics.
As to a "seamanlike manner", one has to specify the boats to even start to discuss this. For many years I raced small and nimble boats that could turn 90° in a boat-length and easily sail dead downwind in a very seamanlike manner. In the original, sailing dead downwind would easily allow Blue to keep clear. I also spent a decade aggressively racing a 60' schooner that required 120' and many seconds (even minutes in light air) to turn 90°. In the Original post, if we're discussing my 60' schooner, as Yellow and a similar boat as Blue, then a prudent skipper aboard Yellow would tack far later than is shown in the original post or would be forced by Rule 15 to slow their tack so that Blue could pass.
In the fleet racing situation you've added to the thread, it could be unwise for Yellow to tack into the wall of approaching Port tack boats along with Blue, but Yellow would NOT be breaking a rule in doing that. Indeed, this is a regular maneuver in team-racing for the leader to get onto starboard after the leeward mark rounding and force the competition away from the mark. Thus, it could be a tactical error but once Yellow has established herself on starboard, the responsibility shifts to all the port tack boats. (Again, this would all depend on the maneuverability of the type of boat in question.)
Do note that the question of a "seaman like" doesn't come into play when there is clearly time for Port tack boats to avoid, even if that requires that they head up aggressively, gybe, or even stop. Claims of poor tactics and strategy do not alter the racing rules.
A final comments, NOT related to the original question. You've stated that "In fleet racing , hard luff and crash jibe are not considered seamanlike way maneuvers." First, I'd like to point out that there is no place in the rules that I can find that appears to support this sentence. Both "hard luff" and "crash jibe" could be "seamanlike" or not depending up the boat, the crew, and the conditions. Going back to the dinghy vs the 60' schooner example, it's obvious that knowledge of the boats involved is crucial. You did describe your thoughts were for ILCA and Opti classes. In your diagram, what is a much more likely scenario is that Red and Blue could end up in a pin-wheel around the mark, Green can easily head up and pass to windward of Yellow. Turquoise and Gray have plenty of time to realize that there is a starboard tack boat coming and to take seaman like action to avoid fouling Yellow. I agree that it might be stupid for Yellow to tack into the face of a herd of port tack boats, but Yellow doesn't seem to be breaking any rule.